FrontDoorAngel
Journeyman
so take the stage, spin down the ages
Posts: 76
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Post by FrontDoorAngel on May 31, 2015 3:18:22 GMT
The A-quad theory.:
There is much talk about the pastoral trilogy of albums by Jethro Tull, which comprises Songs From the Wood in 1977, Heavy Horses in 1978, and Stormwatch in 1979. It occurred to me that the A album of 1980 is a logical progression from those three albums, if you really think about it.
SFTW was focused on Ian's love of English history, particularly the Elizabethan period, as well as pagan traditions that reach back to ancient times. Musically it seems baroque and or Elizabethan, from the beautiful a capella eponymous track's opening, through the incredible music on Velvet Green, etc. HH moves forward in time to the age of agriculture and the beginning of the industrial age: the lament in the eponymous song over the replacement of heavy horses with machinery, the mention of trains in Journeyman, etc. Stormwatch focuses on the sea rather than land, but also moves forward in time.
Now, with the A album, Ian moves still further in time to embrace the technological age, and this seems to me to be a logical progression from the last three albums? The album cover is decidedly set in what was then not only the modern age but in a possible future, as well as a nod to the possible discovery of alien life forms, though Flyingdale Flyer is not about an alien visitation necessarily, but on a misconception or hoax, or so it sounds to me. You never know with IA exactly what he's thinking. His lyrics can be interpreted in so many ways. Then there are mentions of air travel in Black Sunday, big business and money moguls in Working John Working Joe. And then there is side B, where several songs have something to do with the technological age: Protect and Survive, Batteries Not Included, Uniform. And there is the lovely and moving And Further On, which is one of Ian's best tributes to the possibilities - or doom - of mankind.
If this theory of mine has been spoken before, sorry, but I have not seen it. Bear in mind I don't do much reading on this or other Tull boards. I glance here and there and go about things in a rather half-arsed way. I suppose I should go to Amazon and check out reviews of the A album (which I haven't done at the time of writing this). Depending on what I find I'll return and either apologize some more or expand on "my" theory.
I hope this engenders some discussion. If not, that is ok too.
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FrontDoorAngel
Journeyman
so take the stage, spin down the ages
Posts: 76
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Post by FrontDoorAngel on May 31, 2015 3:51:34 GMT
Well, I went to Amazon and read through the reviews of A, and didn't see anything confirming my theory that A is a logical progression from the pastoral trilogy. What I did see is the usual presence of the Five Star Tull Junkies, as well as some bewildering comments, like this one:
It's fascinating to see the degree of variance among diehard Tullians with respect to Tull albums! I can't fathom how a person who says Tull is his/her favorite band could dislike the A album so strongly. I can understand the resentment among Tullians over the "sacking" of key members, over the "reinvention" of Tull (that may have been completely accidental and/or beyond IA's control); but what I can't understand is someone who loves Ian's music disliking any of his albums to such a degree.
I don't dislike any IA and/or Tull release. My least favorite album - probably Dot.Com, is still a Tull album and if I were on a desert island with a choice between Dot.Com or anything by any other band, I'd go with Dot.Com in a heartbeat.
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FrontDoorAngel
Journeyman
so take the stage, spin down the ages
Posts: 76
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Post by FrontDoorAngel on May 31, 2015 4:13:32 GMT
As for the title "A":
Much interesting things to think about. Of course the title came about because the tapes were marked with the letter A, meaning Anderson. But, it's still a happy accident, since the letter A has deep significance in the collective mind:
Nathaniel Hawthorne's Scarlet Letter was a seminal novel that tackles the subject of adultery, love, religious oppression, morality, and feminism. If you haven't read it, read it! Or at the very least watch the film based on the novel starring Gary Oldman, who is arguably the greatest living actor, IMHO, and the ridiculously beautiful Demi Moore.
A is A: Aristotle and Ayn Rand. Huge effect on culture and political thinking, perhaps a lot of it negative, since Rand's philosophy has engendered in a great many people the exact opposite of what she intended: groupthink and intellectual classism/elitism.
Nota: I am NOT suggesting that IA had any of this in mind, or that he places any significance whatsoever on the letter A.
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Post by maddogfagin on May 31, 2015 9:02:14 GMT
The A-quad theory.: There is much talk about the pastoral trilogy of albums by Jethro Tull, which comprises Songs From the Wood in 1977, Heavy Horses in 1978, and Stormwatch in 1979. It occurred to me that the A album of 1980 is a logical progression from those three albums, if you really think about it. SFTW was focused on Ian's love of English history, particularly the Elizabethan period, as well as pagan traditions that reach back to ancient times. Musically it seems baroque and or Elizabethan, from the beautiful a capella eponymous track's opening, through the incredible music on Velvet Green, etc. HH moves forward in time to the age of agriculture and the beginning of the industrial age: the lament in the eponymous song over the replacement of heavy horses with machinery, the mention of trains in Journeyman, etc. Stormwatch focuses on the sea rather than land, but also moves forward in time. Now, with the A album, Ian moves still further in time to embrace the technological age, and this seems to me to be a logical progression from the last three albums? The album cover is decidedly set in what was then not only the modern age but in a possible future, as well as a nod to the possible discovery of alien life forms, though Flyingdale Flyer is not about an alien visitation necessarily, but on a misconception or hoax, or so it sounds to me. You never know with IA exactly what he's thinking. His lyrics can be interpreted in so many ways. Then there are mentions of air travel in Black Sunday, big business and money moguls in Working John Working Joe. And then there is side B, where several songs have something to do with the technological age: Protect and Survive, Batteries Not Included, Uniform. And there is the lovely and moving And Further On, which is one of Ian's best tributes to the possibilities - or doom - of mankind. If this theory of mine has been spoken before, sorry, but I have not seen it. Bear in mind I don't do much reading on this or other Tull boards. I glance here and there and go about things in a rather half-arsed way. I suppose I should go to Amazon and check out reviews of the A album (which I haven't done at the time of writing this). Depending on what I find I'll return and either apologize some more or expand on "my" theory. I hope this engenders some discussion. If not, that is ok too. I'll have to go and have a little lie down and ponder this theory. What I'll add at this time is that most of the Tull albums, or bodies of work which is probably a better term, follow on from the previous BoW, mainly in style and many times in ideas from a previous set of songs. I've never been a paid up member of the trilogy theory preferring to think of SFTW and HH as siblings and Stormwatch and A also being close relatives. So if you like, two pairs of siblings much in the same way as Underwraps and Walk Into Light could be classed by many as being closely related. I do understand those who suggest a "Holy Trinity" of SFTW/HH/Stormwatch but the first two, for me at least, suggest an English pastoral idiom, which those of us who grew up in the countryside can possibly equate to, with the themes that IA writes about, whereas Stormwatch looks ahead to some kind of doomsday or modern day melt down (perhaps) more akin to the ideas suggested in A. Great topic Sir, think this may well solicit some rather fine reading and thoughtful ideas.
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FrontDoorAngel
Journeyman
so take the stage, spin down the ages
Posts: 76
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Post by FrontDoorAngel on May 31, 2015 9:05:24 GMT
Well, I hope I don't wind up talking to myself in this thread. Could be it's just not very interesting, or has in fact been discussed already, in which case a linky to direct me might be of some assistance. I am kicking around the notion of adding a poll to the thread, to see if my theorizing is just sheer ballocks. But I won't do that, naturally, if I'm the only one watching me watching me. By the by, my new avatar is a photo of my mother holding me when I was smaller than I am now. We all start out small. Some of us remain small. I think that despite many opportunities for "advancement", I prefer to remain small. Just watched "Good Will Hunting" for the first time, and was amazed not only by the great writing, but by the way the film struck a chord in me. Or I should say "cord", as in every ounce of bone and sinew. Will laments in one scene how mathematical problems, even the ones that stump geniuses in the field, are so easy for him. The only thing that was ever "easy" for me was learning how to write poetry. It remains the only thing I'm good at. I taught myself how to do it when I was in my mid to late teens, by poring over pages in my brother's English text book: poems by Robert Frost, Tennyson, E.A. Robinson, and Shakespeare, to be precise. When I joined my first online poetry bulletin board, PFFA, in 2001, I was humbled at first, but learned how to stifle my arrogance and self-centeredness by paying attention to what my teachers were telling me. I subsequently refined my skills and spent 7 fruitful years there, for which I was rewarded by being voted 75th best poet on the web in a 2007 poll. If my name had been Zaurle instead of Baurle, I'd have been 93rd. But I consider being 75th a huge honor, being that there were even then literally thousands of people posting poems at the various poetry-oriented BBs. I since went on to Eratosphere, where I gained the attention of dozens of widely published poets, even a few famous ones. However, my stubbornness, or whatever it is, has not given way, and I still eschew formal publication, as I think it's a waste of time and effort. I wouldn't have this opinion if I were born a mere fifty years prior to my birthdate. I only have this view because of the Internet, which, like it or not, is slowly but surely making formal publication a thing of the past. In twenty years' time, or less, there will be almost no need for formal publication, be it in book form, paper journal form, or electronic form. The only reason people will be publishing poetry via small or large presses will be to satisfy a need to see their work in hard copy, or to be assured of their work having demonstrable value in that an editor somewhere was pleased enough to send it to "press". That is a validation, to be certain, but even that will go the way of the dodo bird in time. I love books, and my ego is as strong as anyone's, as is most certainly evident! But as long as I'm alive there will most likely never be a William A. Baurle book in print. Ah well, it is what it is, as my Pop likes to say. But enough about me! Anyone have any thoughts about me? ^ just kidding.
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FrontDoorAngel
Journeyman
so take the stage, spin down the ages
Posts: 76
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Post by FrontDoorAngel on May 31, 2015 9:06:55 GMT
Sorry maddog! We cross posted whilst I was examining my navel!
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Post by maddogfagin on May 31, 2015 9:13:30 GMT
Sorry maddog! We cross posted whilst I was examining my navel!
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FrontDoorAngel
Journeyman
so take the stage, spin down the ages
Posts: 76
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Post by FrontDoorAngel on May 31, 2015 9:15:34 GMT
The A-quad theory.: There is much talk about the pastoral trilogy of albums by Jethro Tull, which comprises Songs From the Wood in 1977, Heavy Horses in 1978, and Stormwatch in 1979. It occurred to me that the A album of 1980 is a logical progression from those three albums, if you really think about it. SFTW was focused on Ian's love of English history, particularly the Elizabethan period, as well as pagan traditions that reach back to ancient times. Musically it seems baroque and or Elizabethan, from the beautiful a capella eponymous track's opening, through the incredible music on Velvet Green, etc. HH moves forward in time to the age of agriculture and the beginning of the industrial age: the lament in the eponymous song over the replacement of heavy horses with machinery, the mention of trains in Journeyman, etc. Stormwatch focuses on the sea rather than land, but also moves forward in time. Now, with the A album, Ian moves still further in time to embrace the technological age, and this seems to me to be a logical progression from the last three albums? The album cover is decidedly set in what was then not only the modern age but in a possible future, as well as a nod to the possible discovery of alien life forms, though Flyingdale Flyer is not about an alien visitation necessarily, but on a misconception or hoax, or so it sounds to me. You never know with IA exactly what he's thinking. His lyrics can be interpreted in so many ways. Then there are mentions of air travel in Black Sunday, big business and money moguls in Working John Working Joe. And then there is side B, where several songs have something to do with the technological age: Protect and Survive, Batteries Not Included, Uniform. And there is the lovely and moving And Further On, which is one of Ian's best tributes to the possibilities - or doom - of mankind. If this theory of mine has been spoken before, sorry, but I have not seen it. Bear in mind I don't do much reading on this or other Tull boards. I glance here and there and go about things in a rather half-arsed way. I suppose I should go to Amazon and check out reviews of the A album (which I haven't done at the time of writing this). Depending on what I find I'll return and either apologize some more or expand on "my" theory. I hope this engenders some discussion. If not, that is ok too. I'll have to go and have a little lie down and ponder this theory. What I'll add at this time is that most of the Tull albums, or bodies of work which is probably a better term, follow on from the previous BoW, mainly in style and many times in ideas from a previous set of songs. I've never been a paid up member of the trilogy theory preferring to think of SFTW and HH as siblings and Stormwatch and A also being close relatives. So if you like, two pairs of siblings much in the same way as Underwraps and Walk Into Light could be classed by many as being closely related. I do understand those who suggest a "Holy Trinity" of SFTW/HH/Stormwatch but the first two, for me at least, suggest an English pastoral idiom, which those of us who grew up in the countryside can possibly equate to, with the themes that IA writes about, whereas Stormwatch looks ahead to some kind of doomsday or modern day melt down (perhaps) more akin to the ideas suggested in A. Great topic Sir, think this may well solicit some rather fine reading and thoughtful ideas. You know, it never occurred to me to even think about the pastoral trilogy thingy, until I read about it! I usually don't have that kind of perception. In fact, I always thought of Stormwatch as being decidedly different, almost contrary to SFTW and HH. But, after I read and read, I found I had to agree with the trilogy idea. It just made sense. Just as my A-quad theory makes sense to me at the moment, even though in a year's time I will probably look back at this thread and be somewhat embarrassed! I can't help thinking of IA stumbling across this thread in his travels and shaking his head, "Another f&^&ing Tull theory! When will these idiots get a life!"
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Post by maddogfagin on May 31, 2015 9:30:30 GMT
I've always had this mental picture of Ian Anderson at his writing desk summoning the muse with some of the pastoral work of Ralph Vaughan Williams playing quietly in the background while composing SFTW and HH.. I've always held the fervent belief that IA knew a great deal about the work of RVW even down to the musical time changes that he used. If folks don't know the work of RVW, his work is in abundance on youtube and "Dives & Lazarus" and "Fantasia on a Theme by Thomas Tallis" are two I'd recommend. www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwr46veZW3Qwww.youtube.com/watch?v=0U6sWqfrnTsBtw, in case you hadn't realised, RVW is my favourite classical composer.
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FrontDoorAngel
Journeyman
so take the stage, spin down the ages
Posts: 76
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Post by FrontDoorAngel on May 31, 2015 9:46:17 GMT
Ouch!
While I have greatly enjoyed the RVW that I've heard: one or two of the symphonies, some sacred pieces, etc., I have a blind spot to him due to the fact that he strongly disliked Mahler, my favorite composer. Actually strongly disliked doesn't quite cut the mustard. It seems to me from the reading I did that he didn't even think of Mahler as a "real" composer, but as an "imitation" of a composer? I'm sure you know a great deal more about his feelings for Mahler than I do, maddog, and I'd love to hear them, even if it broadens my blind spot.
I know of several well known composers who couldn't stand Mahler, Stravinsky being one, and William something or other being another: a well-known and highly touted Brit composer whose name escapes me at the moment.
Then there are guys like Bernstein, who dedicated a good deal of his life to raising Mahler's reputation among his peers and the bloke in the street. But each to his own. We all hear things differently, and music affects each individual in a unique way, or so I believe.
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FrontDoorAngel
Journeyman
so take the stage, spin down the ages
Posts: 76
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Post by FrontDoorAngel on May 31, 2015 9:55:09 GMT
The aforementioned composer who hated Mahler's music, whose first name was William, and whose last name still eludes me, was asked what he thought of Mahler's music, and his response was: "It stinks."
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Post by maddogfagin on May 31, 2015 11:10:25 GMT
The aforementioned composer who hated Mahler's music, whose first name was William, and whose last name still eludes me, was asked what he thought of Mahler's music, and his response was: "It stinks." never knew RVW didn't rate Mahler's music. I only go for the music of a composer 'cos in the long run that's the most important facet of such a person. Still you learn something every day which is good.
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FrontDoorAngel
Journeyman
so take the stage, spin down the ages
Posts: 76
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Post by FrontDoorAngel on May 31, 2015 13:26:01 GMT
The aforementioned composer who hated Mahler's music, whose first name was William, and whose last name still eludes me, was asked what he thought of Mahler's music, and his response was: "It stinks." never knew RVW didn't rate Mahler's music. I only go for the music of a composer 'cos in the long run that's the most important facet of such a person. Still you learn something every day which is good. True! And you just narrowed my blind spot by being so straight-up and rational. I have an account at a classical music site where I can stream anything for free and have options to buy whatever track or album I want. Off to check out Mr. Williams... But first: During my "conversion" I sat in front of my monitor gazing at some site where biblical passages kept popping up (I was at some Bible oriented site but cannot recall why or which site it was). One of them said something like: "You will look into the eyes of your teachers." In my manic, chemically-altered state of consciousness ( ), I was convinced that God was speaking directly to me. I was, of course, the Center of the Known and Unknown Universe (CKUU, for inconvenience) at the time. I ended up on my sofa watching the film Jarhead, and in my muddled state I stared into the eyes of all the actors, who of course were speaking directly to me. I had a profound experience that I can't explain without more of your time and about two thousand more words. When I came out of the hospital a day or two later, I was still addled but coming around enough to realize how truly silly I had been. I watched Jarhead again, months later, and it was a completely different film than the one I watched the first time. What am I getting at? A thank you for teaching me something. Even though I can't see yer eyes.
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FrontDoorAngel
Journeyman
so take the stage, spin down the ages
Posts: 76
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Post by FrontDoorAngel on May 31, 2015 19:16:55 GMT
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Post by steelmonkey on May 31, 2015 23:25:27 GMT
Great thread....much with which i agree, much of which makes sense...and some above my head but no so far above my head that I don't appreciate admirable thoughts and insights about Tull and beyond being volleyed between a pair of Tullies with big brains. One point that stuck out....least favorite Tull album would still surely make the trip to the desert island ahead of other groups' finest moments? Yup. As far as the original thread thought: The way Stormwatch, in retrospect, forms a thematic bridge between the Green of SFTW and HH and the machinery theme on 'A', more than proves that they are related as proposed by FDA....and, as the Dog points out, Ian is working on a body of work and therefore themes, connections, straight lines, curved lines and punch lines can be drawn between all the albums, consecutive and apart.
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FrontDoorAngel
Journeyman
so take the stage, spin down the ages
Posts: 76
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Post by FrontDoorAngel on Jun 1, 2015 3:53:13 GMT
Great thread....much with which i agree, much of which makes sense...and some above my head but no so far above my head that I don't appreciate admirable thoughts and insights about Tull and beyond being volleyed between a pair of Tullies with big brains. One point that stuck out....least favorite Tull album would still surely make the trip to the desert island ahead of other groups' finest moments? Yup. As far as the original thread thought: The way Stormwatch, in retrospect, forms a thematic bridge between the Green of SFTW and HH and the machinery theme on 'A', more than proves that they are related as proposed by FDA....and, as the Dog points out, Ian is working on a body of work and therefore themes, connections, straight lines, curved lines and punch lines can be drawn between all the albums, consecutive and apart. True. I think perhaps only Ian knows exactly what Ian is up to, or was up to, or will be up to. I wrote a huge review of Aqualung on Amazon and regret large bits of it because I went too far trying to get at a man's motivations who is not only a complete stranger to me but who is my superior in virtually every way. I have the option of editing out the bits that I am a bit ashamed of, but I leave them be because I like to be a living testament to man's imperfection and his predilection for error. I wear my heart and my reputation on my sleeve online and in person, and while this may be a bad idea - what with identity theft and the inevitability of self-incrimination and embarrassment in a number of areas - I stick to it, as a means of self therapy as well as survival. If I don't understand myself and my actions, then what is my identity worth anyway? But back to IA: I'm glad my A-quad theory hasn't been completely slammed yet, though I suspect it may happen. I started the thread not so much to further a hypothesis that is no doubt irrelevant and frivolous, but to expand my participation at this great board and to engender conversation, wherever it leads. The idea of A being a logical extension of the pastoral trilogy seems accurate to me, but what you say, steelmonkey, is sensible also: the entire Tull/Anderson catalog is a unified work that spans almost 50 years, a legacy any musician would be proud of, including the great classical composers, with whom IA stands-up as a peer, not an also-ran. I took a listen at the Jethro Tull Group's Youtube channel to David Palmer's music for a UK documentary that featured Coronach. While the original music is superb, I think the version with IA singing is superior, and I would wager a week's pay (amounts to precious little nowadays) that Dee Palmer would agree. Even after the infamous "sacking" before the A album, she still speaks in glowing and reverent terms of her former bandmate, and attests to his unique musical talent, despite the fact that Ian cannot read formal notation, which to him, in his own words, "may as well be Chinese".
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Post by Equus on Jun 1, 2015 6:44:29 GMT
Great thread Mister Front Door Angle! Right now I'm in Berlin... Reading with pleasure, and replying when I get back to Denmark...
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Post by maddogfagin on Jun 1, 2015 8:12:55 GMT
I took a listen at the Jethro Tull Group's Youtube channel to David Palmer's music for a UK documentary that featured Coronach. While the original music is superb, I think the version with IA singing is superior, and I would wager a week's pay (amounts to precious little nowadays) that Dee Palmer would agree. Even after the infamous "sacking" before the A album, she still speaks in glowing and reverent terms of her former bandmate, and attests to his unique musical talent, despite the fact that Ian cannot read formal notation, which to him, in his own words, "may as well be Chinese". You'll probably be very interested in the Q&A we had with Dee a few years back. Very informative. jethrotull.proboards.com/thread/1753/dee-palmer
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FrontDoorAngel
Journeyman
so take the stage, spin down the ages
Posts: 76
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Post by FrontDoorAngel on Jun 1, 2015 8:41:46 GMT
Thanks! I will clickety-clicky post-haste.
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